Unearth the Past: A family history & genealogy podcast

S3 Ep9: A Taskmaster, a Knackerman and an Architect: Unearthing the Past with YouTuber Zac Alsop

• Dr Michala Hulme • Season 3 • Episode 9

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What happens when a modern-day rule-breaker and internet sensation uncovers his deep-rooted past? In this episode of Unearth the Past, host Dr Michala Hulme takes Zac Alsop—YouTuber, master of infiltration, and storytelling genius—on an unexpected journey into his own family history.

From Derbyshire railway workers and architects shaping Manchester to a tragic naval disaster and a mysterious death after a pub night gone wrong, Zac’s family story is anything but ordinary. But will he embrace his true Northern roots? And could history inspire his next viral adventure?

🎧 Tune in now for an unforgettable mix of history, mystery, and discovery!


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Michala Hulme

Zac Alsop 

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Michala:

Hello and welcome back to Unearthed Past, a family history and genealogy podcast where we delve into the lives of interesting people. I'm Dr Michaela Hume, historian and genealogist, and today I'm delighted to be joined by an absolute legend, Someone who's made a name for himself by pushing boundaries, sneaking past security and pulling off some of the most outrageous stunts on the internet. My guest is not just a YouTuber. He's a master of storytelling, risk and pure entertainment, Whether it's dressing up as an athlete to get past Olympic security, hopping on stage at world famous events, or proving that confidence and a bit of cleverness can get you anywhere. With nearly 2 million YouTube subscribers yes, 2 million please welcome the one and only Zach Alsop. Zach, welcome to the podcast. See, this is why you're a professional and I find dead people. Zach, thank you so much for coming on my podcast.

Zac:

I'm buzzing to be here are you excited? Yeah, because I feel like when you turned up at my studio and made me spit in a jar, true story then you disappeared for months and I forgot this was sort of going on. And then you sent me a photo of a gravestone and you're like not unearthing bodies, but you are effectively unearthing the past. So, yeah, I'm curious.

Michala:

Have you thought about delving into it before, or what do you know? Do you know anything about it?

Zac:

I actually don't know a hell of a lot. I know that on my dad's side there's some Yorkshire blood there.

Michala:

Okay.

Zac:

I think, and the same on my mum's side, but on her mum's side. There's some Yorkshire blood there, okay, um, I think, and the same on my mum's side, but on her mum's side okay, yes and I don't know how they got to Somerset and how I became a West Country boy right.

Michala:

Um, I hate to break it to you, but you are not a west country boy. I have never met somebody more derbyshire in my life that's it, derbyshire you are totally derbyshire really every side.

Zac:

Wow, yes, I, I warm to northerners, so maybe that's, uh, that's, that's like a deep-seated thing yeah, we will go through your ethnicity breakdown yeah uh, later on in the podcast, but there is nothing Southern about you, zach. Wow, I never felt like a Southern. I'm just going to say that now.

Michala:

Yeah, you are so Northern, you are more Northern than me, right? I'm going to start with your mum's line. I could have gone down any line of your tree. I think there's interesting people in all of them. I'm going to start with your mum's line, if that's all right with you, yes, let's do it. Now, before we start, I'm going to give you a copy of the family tree.

Zac:

Yeah, let's do it.

Michala:

So this is your family tree.

Zac:

Whoa.

Michala:

It goes back another two generations from there, but I just couldn't fit them all oh my god to your uh family tree, some of your generations. I've got back to 1695 really I have wow but if you get lost at any point so I'm going to be throwing a lot of names at you we can always revert back. Yeah, that's the basic family tree. Do you recognize any of those names?

Zac:

only only the immediate ones that's good yeah only my dad. My dad, my mom and the two, uh, maureen maureen jill, mary maureen jill. No, I just recognized the second name of like buxton and pain and scrivens um bradshaw, no what about gills?

Michala:

do you recognize gills?

Zac:

oh, gill. Oh, I read that as Jill just because, um, I call my nan Jill. Okay, but gill no, I don't recognize gill, but there is a photo there which is cool yeah wow, that's mental. Even just that visually is like how I can see how far that would go off so keep that right I'm going to make a start.

Michala:

Okay, so your grandmother is called sheila so yeah so this is on your mum's side, so we're gonna we're gonna start with your mum's mum's life yeah yeah, and her parents, which would be your great-grandparents, are Howard Buxton and.

Zac:

Mary Gill yeah can you see that on there? I can.

Michala:

Now Howard Buxton. He was born on the 7th of April 1926, in Chapel on Llyfrith.

Zac:

Llyfrith, llyfrith, that sounds.

Michala:

Welsh. It's not actually. I just think I've made it sound Welsh, but it's not Chapel in the Forest.

Zac:

Oh, okay. The only reason I know that is because all these places are near me.

Michala:

Oh really, it was considering you are the furthest guest yeah we've had on. So just let you know. The reason that the background is different is because we're recording this in London. You were the closest tree. Well, that's I've ever done yeah, I made you.

Zac:

Okay, I don't feel as guilty for making you get the train now no, that's fine.

Michala:

So chapel only for which is in derbyshire yes did you know you had a derbyshire connection?

Zac:

yes, I, I got that mistaken at the front derbyshire. Yeah, I did know this okay so howard buxton.

Michala:

He is the son of arthur les, Leslie Buxton and Jesse Minchell, who would be your great, great grandparents. Now I have found Howard and his parents just before World War II on the 1939 register, if you would like to see it, Okay. So if you have a look, this is taken just before the war. You should find the Buxtons somewhere on there.

Zac:

Is this Buxton like the water?

Michala:

So this is a strange thing.

Zac:

Am I an heir to a water multinational company? No, I'm so sorry.

Michala:

So they are called Buxton.

Zac:

Yeah.

Michala:

And they live in Buxton. Just to make things really confusing.

Zac:

It used to be simpler times, didn't it?

Michala:

Yeah, but they're not originally from Buxton.

Zac:

Oh, wow, okay.

Michala:

That's mental, so can you see Howard Buxton somewhere.

Zac:

Yes, what's that three next to his name?

Michala:

Okay, so you should have. On the left-hand side is the road where they live.

Zac:

Okay, yeah.

Michala:

You might just be able to make out the top of the page. Sometimes it's right at the top.

Zac:

Yeah.

Michala:

I don't know if you can make any of that out 35 Dackham Avenue. Okay.

Zac:

Or something, avenue 38,. Oh ditto, so 35 and 38 something avenue and then 36 and 34. But they're different people that live on that same road, right yeah?

Michala:

that's correct.

Zac:

So number 34 was the Buxtons, and there was one, two, three, four, five of them in that house. So Howard Buxton is a man and he was born on April, the 26th, on a Sunday. Is that what's? S-m-w or D? Not a Sunday, born on a Sunday? No, that doesn't make sense.

Michala:

Right, okay.

Zac:

He was small.

Michala:

We have got Howard Buxton. He was born. He was small. We have got Howard Buxton. He was born. He was a male. He was born on the 7th of April 1926. And he is single.

Zac:

I thought he was. He was small.

Michala:

He's definitely not small, short man. He probably was.

Zac:

I mean, we don't know he's probably a short man.

Michala:

He might be really short, we just don't know. Short man he probably was. I mean, we don't know, he's probably a short man, he might be really short, we just don't know. So also living in that house is his dad, which is Arthur Buxton.

Zac:

How old is the dad, like at the time of the census? So this is 1939.

Michala:

And the dad was born on the 1st of September 1900. So he'd have been about 39. Wow, he is a labourer on the railway. And then you've got Jessie Buxton, who is Howard's mum. She was born on the 13th of March 1904 and she's looking after the kids. And then you've got Howard, patricia and Reg is Howard the oldest. Howard is the oldest.

Zac:

Howard is the oldest, so I'm going to keep going back yeah, it's all right, let's keep going turning back the hands of time literally.

Michala:

Now I have a picture of howard from around the time have you found that from around the time that uh register, the 1939 register, was taken, would you you like to see it?

Zac:

Yes, when was cameras invented? I should probably know that.

Michala:

When were cameras invented, the century before, so we're good how bad.

Zac:

Okay, my timeline's a whale Whoa.

Michala:

Could you describe him for our listeners?

Zac:

Oh, he's a handsome chap. He's got a slightly receding hairline, he's got a decent choice of hairstyle. I'd say He'd fit in in the modern times, a bit of a sort of quiff which curls around both sides. One massive left ear, or am I saying that wrong? Does that look like a massive left ear to you? It does, actually.

Michala:

I think he me yeah.

Zac:

It's a bad. I mean it's not a bad photo, but it's a very pixelated photo. He looks like you're sort of. He looks like he'd do well for himself. Yeah, old Howard.

Michala:

He looks like he wouldn't struggle, would he?

Zac:

No Open college shirt If he was on a dating website people would be swiping.

Michala:

They'd be snapping that right up. Yeah, his thick neck clearly works out. That's the best description of anyone I've ever had in my life. So that was around the time of the 1939 register. In 1946, he marries Mary Maureen Gill, and I'm going to pick up her story shortly.

Zac:

Mary Maureen is a phone.

Michala:

Mary Maureen Gill. I'm going to pick up her story shortlyary. Maureen, is it mary maureen gill? I'm going to pick up her her story shortly, but I'm going to keep going, if that's okay yeah so we're going to go down the line of arthur leslie buxton who is howard's dad now.

Michala:

He was born on the first of september, as we've just had, as we've just looked at 1900. He was baptized at saint mary's church, which is in buxton. He married on the 25th of october 1924 at the parish church in a place called fairfield which is in buxton, which I went to the other day, and the church is still there that rings a bell, does it?

Zac:

a lot of your family are from fairfield really they all are from fairfield, yeah interesting. Yeah, nothing like it rings a bell, but no, I've got a terrible memory so it might come up later now when he he gets married.

Michala:

Uh, what a marriage certificate does? It not only tells us what occupation the person does he gets married, but it also gives us the name and the occupation of his father. So arthur leslie's father is a guy called harry buxton, who would be your three times great grandfather. He worked for the lancashire and yorkshire railway. He was born in Titherington, near Macclesfield, on the 13th of August 1876. And he was the first one to be employed on the railway.

Zac:

Wow.

Michala:

So he was employed on the railway within the family. And his son would also go on to be employed.

Zac:

So he was driving trains. He was driving trains, two-two Steam trains. Well, it would have been then, yeah, for the Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway. Wow yeah, big, big job that is.

Michala:

Now, harry's father, who is your four times great-grandfather was called Alfred Buxton and he was employed as a porter at the Macclesfield workhouse, and he was basically a bit like a security guard, right, so he would sit on reception and he would monitor those going in, yeah, going into the workhouse and also coming out what's a workhouse? So a workhouse is where the very poorest of people would go, so if you needed help, yeah whereas now it'd be universal credit.

Zac:

Yeah, we called the dolden it years ago.

Michala:

Before there was a welfare system like what we have today.

Zac:

It was the workhouse.

Michala:

Okay, and it was a place where you would go. That was that bad. It would put you off wanting to get help.

Zac:

Oh, really yeah, Deliberately or just. Deliberately, oh really Deliberately yeah yeah, deliberately or deliberately, oh, really deliberately. Yeah, it was so bad. So do you reckon he was a bit of a?

Michala:

he was a bit of a ruffian. Well, we know that he was, uh, you know he sort of worked on reception, so he's monitoring people coming in and going out. But he was also what we call a task master, and you have got some great occupations in your tree and this is one of them task master.

Zac:

It's a great TV show.

Michala:

This is a great TV show and I'm hoping that this might inspire some new videos from you.

Zac:

Okay, nice, yeah, I love that.

Michala:

So a taskmaster is somebody who oversees and manages all the inmates, and that's what they were called. All the inmates work, so if you got put into the workhouse because you needed help, you would be expected to work, and that could be breaking stones was probably the most popular. I know they did that at Macclesfield Workhouse.

Zac:

Yeah.

Michala:

Agricultural work, picking oakum, which is like bits of rope. It was basically you were working for your keep. He was in charge of maintaining discipline amongst the inmates wow and using punishments to ensure compliance wow they were often seen as somebody who was quite strict and somebody you know who made sure that everybody stuck to the rules. Now there was a hierarchy in the workhouse. So you have your matron.

Zac:

Yeah.

Michala:

You have your master, and then you have his wife.

Zac:

Okay.

Michala:

And then your ancestor was the third in command.

Zac:

What I'm confused about, though when you say workhouse, I imagine they're going into a massive building and doing all the work in there.

Michala:

That's probably not how it went right so it's a very, a lot of them now are hospitals. If you imagine a very old style hospital, I'm going to show you a picture in a moment okay but if you imagine a very old style victorian hospital, mean there were institutions, yeah, that's kind of what it was like, and when you went in they made sure you were clean.

Zac:

Yeah.

Michala:

They took your clothes off you, they gave you a uniform.

Zac:

There was Jeez.

Michala:

They kept people separate so they didn't want people who were you know sort of what they deemed as ladies of the night mixing with other people. You know of what they deemed as ladies of the night mixing with other people, you know, mixing with the young girls yeah so the children, the men and the women were all kept on separate wards like that is your like last resort to go somewhere like that?

Zac:

yeah, how do you get out? Yeah?

Michala:

you get out through work. So, for example, it's like one step before prison.

Zac:

Basically, if you can't pay your way or you check yourself in there to say Well, you check yourself in, because you get a bed and you get food. Oh, okay, okay, but you have to work for it. Jeez man, yeah, that's rough.

Michala:

Think Oliver Twist.

Zac:

Yeah.

Michala:

That's exactly what it was like when Oliver Twist goes into the workhouse.

Zac:

Oh, is that what it is? That's what it is. No way Wow.

Michala:

So he was the third in command, but before he worked at the workhouse he was an assistant at the Parkside Lunatic Asylum. Wow, okay.

Zac:

Just up the road.

Michala:

Which is in Macclesfield, so it was just around the corner from the Macclesfield workhouse was the. Parkside Lunatic Asylum.

Zac:

Is that what it was called?

Michala:

Yeah.

Zac:

Really.

Michala:

Parkside Lunatic Asylum.

Zac:

Wow, imagine being there.

Michala:

So there's going to be people watching this podcast who thinks that's really familiar. Why do we know of that? Okay and that's because at the time he worked at the parkside lunatic asylum. Have you heard of a band called the blossoms? Yeah okay, so one of my other guests who's been on this podcast is the lead singer of the Blossoms a guy called Tom Ogden.

Zac:

Yeah.

Michala:

And Tom Ogden's great great grandfather was a patient in that workhouse at the same time that your ancestor was working there as an attendant.

Zac:

That's mad. What are the chances of that? That's crazy. Wow. What did you think when you discovered that as well? I bet that was a bit of a. Has that ever happened before? Never, really Never, wow.

Michala:

In all the years I've been researching family trees, I've never been able to link two of my trees before.

Zac:

That's so wild.

Michala:

He has no idea of this. I'm going to ring him on my way back and say did you know this?

Zac:

Yeah, if I ever bump into him, that'll be my opener. So how big was this institution? Did it have like hundreds of people?

Michala:

I've got a picture, so this is the Parkside Lunatic Asylum.

Zac:

Oh my, Actually it looks really nice. I'm sure it wasn't, but Does that still stand?

Michala:

today. No, no, it's gone, it's not like a mega Wetherspoons or something. Part of it is still there. They turned it into a posh apartment.

Zac:

Did they? Yeah, that makes sense that, like the east wing no, the west wing of that looks like a fancy manor house. Wow, that's so wild. I mean like presumably that's sort of brand new-ish around that time.

Michala:

Yeah, it would have been.

Zac:

Yeah, that's sort of a late Victorian picture, it looks well kept, but it does kind of look a bit haunted in the same way.

Michala:

All the patient records, for those still exist and the photographs of the patients still exist in the field office.

Zac:

yeah, so there's no photos of the staff.

Michala:

No.

Zac:

They didn't have LinkedIn. Back then I tried no professional headshots, wow, no, they didn't have linkedin. Back then, no professional headshots wow, what would that?

Michala:

role entail, then, like it would, it would have been supervising treatment, which then was quite brutal yeah, a lot of it was electric shock, electric shock treatment was used. Yeah, now.

Zac:

So he slotted into the workhouse real easily with that experience yeah, so I hope he was a bit nicer to the work. Well, no, no, no, no, no, I can't say that.

Michala:

I hope it's nice to everyone, but I'm sure there are so many newspaper articles about him um at one point he got assaulted, actually by one of the inmates.

Zac:

He was okay it wasn't mr blossom, was it it?

Michala:

definitely wasn't. This was in the workhouse, not the loom. Okay, okay, okay. It was a mystery I mentioned to you about Mary Maureen Gill.

Zac:

Yes, yeah, mmg.

Michala:

MG and I want to go down her line, if that's okay with you.

Zac:

Yeah.

Michala:

So Mary was born in 1924 in Chapel on Liffrith which we've just spoke about before. Her husband is obviously the Buxton Howard Buxton who we've just spoke about. Her father was a gentleman called Joseph Bradshaw Gill and her mum was Lily Maude Palfreyman. Joseph Bradshaw Gill would be your great-great-grandfather. He was born in Buxton, Derbyshirehire. On the 1st of september 1891. I found joseph bradshaw gill on the 1911 census living in buxton. I'm gonna pass you this over so you should be able to see on there. Yeah, joseph bradshaw gill, um, who's your great, great grandfather. You should be able to see him on there and you should also be able to see his parents, which will be your great-great-great-grandfather.

Zac:

Okay, oh, I like this handwriting. This is better. Who am I looking for?

Michala:

So you should see Joseph Bradshaw Gill.

Zac:

Joseph Bradshaw Gill. Yeah, Single, okay. Personal occupation Dyer and channel assistant of Suplementos.

Michala:

That was so beautiful. I don't even think that's an occupation, but I feel it could be.

Zac:

Have I got the first one right?

Michala:

He works in cotton, he works in fabric.

Zac:

Oh, okay, diet and something assistant, okay cool.

Michala:

Now, if you look right at the top, you should see his parents.

Zac:

Yeah, joseph, another Joseph.

Michala:

So that's his dad.

Zac:

Joseph Annis.

Michala:

That's his mum, Annis.

Zac:

Hellie.

Michala:

Sister Daughter, yeah, sister.

Zac:

Stanley Bartholomew, brother Brother, yeah, yeah, so there's five of them.

Michala:

What's his dad doing for a job?

Zac:

His dad is a building clerk of County. Caramel, I can't read that right. Education Is that what it says. County Education.

Michala:

So I think he works for the council and he works for the education department.

Zac:

He's a surveyor, oh, I'm sorry, I thought the job, the job title was. I've been reading the job title as the industry service. That's just one long thing, okay, yeah, building clerk of works thank you, and where's it?

Michala:

does it say where he was born, right at the end of the dad? I don't know if you can make that out.

Zac:

Something Wade Bridge.

Michala:

Cornwall.

Zac:

Cornwall, cornwall, wade Bridge Is it Cornwall? It looked Cos Cosmo. I'm so bad at this.

Michala:

No, you're not the worst, honestly. Yeah, so that is Cornwall, cornwall. Cornwall really so. The gills are from Cornwall. Did you know you had a Cornwall connection?

Zac:

no, I didn't, but I've always liked Cornwall. Are you glad you've got a? Cornwall connection that's crazy because that's pretty far, especially back in them days. That's like a 40-day trek.

Michala:

Yeah, well not quite. Travelling across America. So the Gills are from Cornwall, but I suppose you want to know how they started in Cornwall and ended up in Derbyshire. So, I'm going to fill you in on that now.

Zac:

Hang on. You said that I'm more of a Northerner, but we've gone back down south again.

Michala:

A few generations yet, so bear with me. So Joseph Bradshaw Gill. Then His father was Joseph Gill. Joseph Gill was born on the 15th of March 1948 in St Austin in Cornwall.

Zac:

I know St Austin.

Michala:

Do you? I've never been to St Austin, is it nice.

Zac:

I've been to Newquay quite a few times Newquay's nice, yeah, st Austin's nice.

Michala:

His mother is Susan Tabb and his father is Gregory Gill. They would be your four times great grandparents, gil. They would be your four times great grandparents. Wow, gregory Gil was born in Cornwall in 1824. And at the age of 20, he marries Susan Tabb in Bodmin Bodmin. The couple had seven children. Now, when I found Seven, seven kids.

Zac:

Wow.

Michala:

Now, when I found Gregory just after they'd got married, on the 1851 census he is a carpenter but he doesn't stay a carpenter. So by 1861, he's left Cornwall and the whole family have moved up north to Burnley.

Zac:

Burnley.

Michala:

Good old Burnley.

Zac:

Why.

Michala:

I think with his job, because when I find him in 1861 on the census he is no longer a carpenter, he's an architect.

Zac:

Oh, wow. So he's made a bit of a job. He's made a few connections down in Cornwall.

Michala:

So they move to Burnley, then they moved to Huddersfield and then they settled in a place called Stalybridge which is in Greater Manchester area. So I've already mentioned then that he came to Stalybridge and he was an architect. But he wasn't just any old architect. He designed quite a lot of staley bridge really he did. Okay, I have a busy man I have a picture of some of the buildings that he designed if you would like to see them yeah so he designed the Liberal Club.

Zac:

Oh hello, Is that still there today?

Michala:

No no.

Zac:

That's a cracking building Fair play, I've got another one that's solid.

Michala:

He designed the local co-op, which I think is beautiful. What the local co-op? Have you seen the building? Oh my God.

Zac:

That's got to be fancy flats now.

Michala:

Quite possibly, yeah.

Zac:

That's really cool. Whoa yeah, that's stunning. How did you find this? Where is this?

Michala:

And if ever you come to Staley Bridge, there is something that is still there now and that's a public park called stamford park really and he designed the park, the park, the park.

Zac:

It's massive and not a lot of building there, the park, it's just well, yeah, that's cool. That is cool, that's like a solid piece of history I have so many advertisements that he has put in the newspaper. What for his services?

Michala:

Yeah, just like for his services, there are absolutely loads of them.

Zac:

New primitive Methodist day Sunday schools are about to be built at Newton Moor, hide, cheshire, from plans by Mr Gregory Gill, architect of Stadybridge, chosen in a limited competition. Wow, he was active.

Michala:

He was really, really active.

Zac:

He was a driven man.

Michala:

He was a driven man. I see that in you and your videos. Can you draw?

Zac:

I'm alright, I do like Cornwall, though. Can you draw? I'm all right, I do like Cornwall, though. So we've got a lot in common. Actually, he didn't. He ran away.

Michala:

These are just some of the buildings that he has designed.

Zac:

No way, that's a lot I will send you those.

Michala:

So you're probably wondering was the architect Gene in any of the children?

Zac:

Yeah, did it pass down. Yeah.

Michala:

Well, we know that your three times great grandfather, joseph, was a surveyor, which is probably why he moved from Stalybridge to Buxton Chapel, only Frith area. It's not that far, probably about 30 minutes by car. Obviously he wouldn't have gone by car, but that's roughly where it is today yeah um, the other sons. One of them tried to go down the architect road. Didn't quite want to it. He then went into the leather trade okay the only other son that did carry on was called william, which is your great, great great grandfather joseph's brother, william.

Zac:

Wow, big Willie, sorry William Willie.

Michala:

This is all stable Now. William Gill he was the middle son of Gregory Gill and Susan Tabb and, like his father, as I've already mentioned, he followed in his dad's footsteps. He became an architect and surveyor in Stalybridge. In 187777 William married Alice Chadwick and the couple had two children William Leonard Gill and Clara Gill. Things take a bit of a turn and I'm going to show you a couple of records now which relate to William Gill, and this first record relates to his son. If you can just summarise what type of record it is, don't worry about trying to read it.

Zac:

Oh no, it's a death record. Calls of death. Oh, I can't even read the person Measles, measles, yeah.

Michala:

Oh, no, that's sad and can you see how old, he was yeah.

Zac:

Oh no, that's sad.

Michala:

And how can you see how old he was?

Zac:

Four. Four years old, oh no, william.

Michala:

And then, two years after his death, I want to show you another record.

Zac:

Poor guy.

Michala:

So this is his wife and this is from 1885. I wonder if you can just tell me what sort of record that is okay.

Zac:

It's another death record. These are fun. 32 cause of death tb tb the bloody badgers. No way it must have been so crazy to live back then, like a small cut could just wipe you out.

Michala:

Well, not only that. So can you imagine now, he's obviously lost his wife, right? He's then lost his son already, so it's just him and his daughter Clara.

Zac:

Oh no, but oh no. Clara, oh no, but oh no.

Michala:

I think it's pretty fair to say that he struggled after he lost his wife and his son right so Clara doesn't live with him again, she goes to live with another family member. And then I found another record relating to him and I wondered if you could just. This was in the local newspaper. I wonder if you could just read out the top paragraph.

Zac:

I knew it was all going too well. We've had an unravelling.

Michala:

So if you can just read just that top paragraph, that'd be great it says which one. Death of a well-known Stalybridge man.

Zac:

Death of a well-known Stalybridge man. Death of a well-known Stalybridge man. On Wednesday morning, information was received by the Stalybridge police that a man had been found dead in Hall's Model Lodging House.

Michala:

He didn't have a fixed address, he was just going around. Lodging house, oh, lodging house.

Zac:

Yeah, oh no, on Chapel Street. The report turned out to be correct, the deceased being a well-known town man in the person of william gill, an architect aged 41 years, deceased, had for some considerable time past led a very intemperate life, having slept at lodging houses and become very dissipated. It's like the sad. It's so sad that this gets reported. Um become very dissipated on tuesday night. He retired to bed as a usual, but as usual, but shortly after eight o'clock the following morning he was discovered in the bedroom with his head resting on a chair, life having apparently been extinct for some time. What wording is that?

Michala:

I know so he had not been medically so it was a really long inquest I will obviously give you that murder. They don't well they didn't know what he died of, so they did this, the inquest. Honestly it's so long, but basically I think he'd become alcohol dependent and there was loads of witnesses that were talking about they'd bought him whiskey and they kept buying him alcohol.

Zac:

Oh, really, and he was just.

Michala:

You won't believe this. What a cruel twist of fate. This is right. So on the day he dies, they find him in the morning, and that day his daughter's getting married.

Zac:

You're joking, no, you're joking no.

Michala:

So on her marriage certificate, when it says father, it says deceased, he dies the morning, the morning of wedding oh my god, right, that is.

Zac:

Some people just get a bad hand at life, don't they?

Michala:

yeah, sorry, it's all right. I'm gonna keep going, if that's all right, yeah let's, let's, let's.

Zac:

Look, we're getting into the in the juicy bits now.

Michala:

Let's have a look at your dad's side.

Zac:

Let's do it.

Michala:

Okay, so your paternal grandparents are Graham Russell Olsop and Gillian Mary Georgina Scrivens.

Zac:

Does that name ring a bell?

Michala:

Yes, I have a copy of their marriage certificate.

Zac:

Would you like to see it? Yeah, let's do it, because they got divorced.

Michala:

Okay, well, at this time they were happy. Yeah, From the marriage certificate you can read that your great-grandparents are Anthony William Alsop and Elaine Bradshaw.

Zac:

Yes.

Michala:

Anthony William Alsop was born on the 4th of Feb 1906 in Darley Dale, which is near Matlock, and that was where I was when I sent you an image from a graveyard.

Zac:

Oh my God, dally Dale.

Michala:

He is the oldest of seven children born to Anthony Senior Allsop and Winifred Bennett, who would be your great, great grandparent. So he is the oldest, anthony Senior. Then we've got five girls and then the youngest child is a boy called Christopher, who was named after his grandfather. We're going to come back to Christopher Senior in a minute. By the age of 16, anthony, your great-grandad, had left the home and he was working as a servant on a farm.

Zac:

Really, it's like a farm labourer. Yeah, yeah, on the farm. Okay, humble.

Michala:

Yeah, he married your great grandmother, elaine, at the Independent Chapel in Matlock in 1933. And in 1939, just before World War II, anthony, your great-grandfather, was working in a stone quarry. Sadly by 1939, his father, Anthony Senior, had passed away, but his mum, Winifred, was still alive and she was working as a cook in the home of Cecil Henry Armitage, who was from the Red Cross. I think he was quite high up in the Red Cross.

Michala:

Sounds fancy, name it was a fancy name and it was a very fancy house and had a lot of people working in his house. Now there was also somebody in the house who was quite high up in the Royal Navy and, believe it or not, she has something in common with him and that's because her youngest son, Anthony's only brother, Christopher, is serving in the Royal Navy during World War II.

Zac:

Wow.

Michala:

He served on board a ship called HMS Nigeria, and this is the ship.

Zac:

No way.

Michala:

Whoa he served on.

Zac:

That's cool.

Michala:

Now, on the 10th of August 1942, HMS Nigeria was playing its part in something called Operation Pedestal.

Zac:

This doesn't sound good this.

Michala:

Operation Pedestal was a critical British naval operation during World War II and basically it was to resupply the island of Malta. So Malta at that time was under siege by the Axis forces and strategically for us it was vital. But the problem is they were running out. They were running out of food, they were running out of fuel and military supplies. So there was a plan that they were going to go in convoy and send over supplies okay 13 ships went over and only four out of the 13 reached malta no what, on the 12th of August, a torpedo from an Italian submarine struck the ship on the port side, killing 52 and wounding 15.

Zac:

Oh my.

Michala:

And I've got an image that I'm going to show you now.

Zac:

Wow.

Michala:

So that is the ship after it had been hit.

Zac:

Oh no, oh dear, oh dear.

Michala:

And this record relates to Christopher. I don't know if you can make out what that record is if you read the top columns.

Zac:

Christopher, port, division, ranchers. Date of birth. Place of birth. Cause of death. Place of death at sea for Christopher Orsop. I'm looking at Christopher, right yeah.

Michala:

Yeah.

Zac:

At sea and what's cause of death? One, it says.

Michala:

Yeah, so that means that his ship was torpedoed. They have like different categories, oh no, christopher, that's very sad.

Zac:

Oh poor guy, that must have been scary.

Michala:

Yeah, yeah.

Zac:

So he died off the coast of Malta.

Michala:

Basically yeah, and he was buried.

Zac:

He was close or.

Michala:

They managed to get the ship back to Malta, believe it or not, but unfortunately I read some reports and people. Could you know people who survived? It can still hear the screams of the people that unfortunately just couldn't, didn't make it off.

Zac:

So killed by Italians.

Michala:

Killed by an Italian submarine.

Zac:

Wow.

Michala:

Yeah, now, I mentioned earlier that Christopher was named after his granddad, christopher, who was your three times great grandfather, christopher Alsop, who was born in Lee, derbyshire in 1844.

Zac:

Wow, sop who was born in lee, derbyshire in 1844.

Michala:

Wow, on the 15th of june 1868 he marries your three times great-grandmother, sarah parks. He worked as an engine driver in a lead mine an engine driver in a lead mine. He was also very good at billiards okay yeah, he'd play a bit of Paul.

Zac:

My uncle's good at that. Maybe it's sort of I don't know.

Michala:

When I was doing my research, I uncovered a really long article about Christopher. I'm going to just show you a bit of it. I wonder if you could just summarize what this article is here we go.

Zac:

I can't tell by the look on your eyes whether it's a good thing or a bad thing maybe read the title, so this relates to christopher oh no, not again.

Zac:

Sad fatality on matlock cliff. The inquest, the report furnished to the coroner, shows john rogers miller reported at 7 45 on monday morning that christopher alsop had died at his house that morning. He stated that at nine o'clock the previous night he and henry greer at greek greeter x carter of matlock cliff were walking down the highway at matlock cliff when they noticed somebody lying on the graze lying on the grass field occupied by mr e bailey. Greeter x got over the wall and found it was all sop. It is supposed that he was in company with george charlesworth who works at farley quarry, darley dale oh, farley quarry, dar Dale and that he fell over the wall accidentally. I shouldn't laugh. The wall is 18 inches high at this point from the walk and about seven feet deep into the field. The deputy coroner held an inquest at the Horseshoe Hotel on Tuesday morning. No, another one bites the dust.

Michala:

So I've read this is like that's page one.

Zac:

Oh my.

Michala:

There's two pages of this inquest. So what happened was? What I think happened is they went to the pub.

Zac:

Oh, no, they had a few.

Michala:

They were coming back and he fell over this wall with a seven foot drop onto his friend. Now it's a bit confusing. Well, they both fell over. They both fell over. It's a bit confusing because I think I'm not quite sure if one leaves the other one.

Zac:

Yeah.

Michala:

I think he sort of maybe leaves him. Anyway, for whatever reason, there's obviously an inquest to think did he just fall? Yeah, was it an accident? Was he pushed? So it's a really really long, obviously an inquest to think did he just fall? Was it an accident?

Zac:

Was he pushed Interesting?

Michala:

So it's a really, really long inquest. The coroner does find at the end that when they look at the medical evidence that he wasn't pushed, that he did just fall. But how do you?

Zac:

fall from a drop, he must have landed pretty badly.

Michala:

I feel you could take this up with the history police.

Zac:

I need to get that case reopened.

Michala:

I feel you could take this up with the history police. I need to get that case reopened.

Zac:

I feel you should do that murder so died on the way back from the pub. That's not as cool as getting blown up on a ship outside malta um.

Michala:

So I did go back just to wrap the all sops up. I did manage to go back quite a way with the all sops um, I managed to go back to your eight times great-grandfather, isaac all sop, who was born in 1651. I also went to darley dale and visited the final resting place of many of your early all sop ancestors most of these, and you have seen the pictures. I'm going to show you guys, the pictures, pictures. Now I am just going to very briefly talk to you about another section of your tree and that's the pains.

Michala:

That's on your mum's side yeah of your tree, the pains could be out. Of all your ancestors, my most favourite, and that is because your great-great-grandfather is a bit of a character. He's called Ernest James Payne and he's a knacker's man.

Zac:

A what A knacker's man Is that a job, or is that, yeah, a knacker's man have you ever heard of?

Michala:

that.

Zac:

No.

Michala:

Okay, man, have you ever heard of that? No, okay, so anaka's man was somebody that was basically uh, would take horses. It was like an abattoir for horses oh, no, and would turn them into meat where did he live?

Zac:

was that in derbyshire?

Michala:

So he lived in Somerset. Yes, yes, did you know about this?

Zac:

Well, so my granddad, my gran and granddad's house in Froome I think they built. It was built on an abattoir. It was built. They live where that used to be.

Michala:

Really.

Zac:

So they still have that house.

Michala:

No way.

Zac:

Yeah, because I used to hear stories about the abattoir and the horses, because the family's like my granddad's dad, percy, was really involved with horses and my granddad was a cattle auctioneer. That's it, dh, payne and Sons, the firm's new slaughter slaughterhouse. Wow, oh wow. They had lots mobile welding. They had the fingers in a lot of pies but he was so funny, so that's that wait, sorry, there's one line there which is crazy highest possible prices paid for live casualty and fresh dead horses and cows. You need to send me this. That's great.

Michala:

I'll send you all these.

Zac:

Wow.

Michala:

I have so many of these articles, by the way. They just sort of go on and on.

Zac:

So they were all about their business.

Michala:

And on. Yeah, I have loads. What was quite interesting, though, for me was I found a really interesting article where it was basically it looks like a financial insolvency case involving Ernest James Payne right. And he lived on Water Lane at the time in Froome, and it states that he had liabilities. So he had debts of £1,469, but he had no assets, so there was nothing of value right to offset these debts.

Michala:

When questioned by the official receiver, which is the person who's sort of responsible for seeing what he's got, he said that he kept no financial records or account books, that he had a diary, but in that diary was only the weather and the days he attended at chapel.

Zac:

I think he's shoving cash in his mattress. He's swindling it away somehow.

Michala:

So basically they said like where are your accounts, where are your books? He's like well, I've got this diary.

Zac:

I just journal about the weather.

Michala:

About the weather and what days he went to church oh wow, that's funny can I just say that thank you so much for coming on my podcast. I know that you wanted to know. We have to wrap it up now, but I know you wanted to know about your ethnicity breakdown.

Zac:

Yes, what's also interesting is that somewhere, somewhere along the line, we lost one l in our surname yeah, so there is it said also, but it's like my name is spelled al sop yeah these decided to get rid of it's double l sometimes it's one l get rid, you go back, it's double yeah, so it is, it should be double.

Michala:

It should be double yeah so your ethnicity breakdown then you are 79, 79 percent england and northwestern europe okay you. I can break that down even further and it's basically like the derbyshire yeah region. You are nine percent irish. You are six percent dramatic europe 9% Irish. You are 6% Germanic Europe, 6% Scotland and 1% and this is on your dad's side North African.

Zac:

Really.

Michala:

Yeah, just less than 1% North African.

Zac:

Wow, yeah, like Morocco and that neck of the woods.

Michala:

Yeah, like that neck of the woods, like Algeria, Libya, Morocco, Algeria.

Zac:

I was in Algeria last year Western.

Michala:

Sahara libya was in algeria last year.

Zac:

western sahara I did feel at home in algeria last year.

Michala:

You have a little bit of that there's none of that left.

Zac:

I burn so easily. I'm terrible. Oh wow, that's so interesting. That is crazy. Wait. So my girlfriend's family's gonna love this, because they're stewarts and they're scottish. They're gonnaarts and they're Scottish. They're going to love that. I have a bit of Scotland.

Michala:

You have got a bit of Scotland in you.

Zac:

My question is at what percentage can I claim an Irish passport?

Michala:

That's what I want to know you are the most sort of northern less Irish I've done in a good while.

Zac:

Really, yeah, oh no, your Irish is too Irish is too small. You're stuck with us, but my beard goes ginger no, you're stuck with the black passport.

Michala:

Sorry, zach Zach. Thank you so much, mate, I proper appreciate that thank you, that was so interesting so that is it for this week's podcast.

Michala:

a huge thank you to my guest, zach Alsop, and a huge thank you for listening and thank you for contacting me. I, alsop, and a huge thank you for listening and thank you for contacting me. I know some of you have sent me messages which hopefully I've replied to everybody by now, but thank you so much. At the time of this going out, we have had over three million watches, downloads whatever you call them of the podcast. So so thank you so much. Honestly, I started this as a bit of a passion project a year ago just over a year ago and never thought I would ever see these crazy numbers. Hitting 3 million is huge. So thank you so much. I really appreciate it and if you want to contact me, if you want any aspect of historical research undertaken, you can contact me and the team via my website, which is wwwmichaelahumecom. Thank you so much and I'll see you again soon.