Unearth the Past: A family history & genealogy podcast
Step into the fascinating world of genealogy and family history with Unearth the Past, a podcast hosted by the charismatic Dr. Michala Hulme. This show masterfully blends riveting discussions, deep dives into historical contexts, and practical tips for uncovering your ancestral roots. Each week, Dr Hulme welcomes an eclectic mix of guests—musicians, actors, sports stars, and public figures—unravelling the remarkable and often surprising stories hidden within their family trees.
Beyond these compelling narratives, the podcast serves as a treasure trove for genealogy enthusiasts, spotlighting essential tools and resources for research. It also paints a vivid picture of the social and cultural landscapes that shaped family histories, exploring powerful themes like immigration, industrial revolutions, and the resilience of past generations.
If you would like to get in touch with Michala, you can do so via her website, www.michalahulme.com
If you want to help support the making of the podcast, please visit Michala's Patreon account https://www. patreon.com/DrMichalaHulme
Unearth the Past: A family history & genealogy podcast
S3 Ep1: Comedy, Cranes and Cains: Unearthing the past with comedian Paul Smith
Join Dr Michala Hulme on "Unearth the Past" as she unravels the incredible family history of Paul Smith, one of Britain's most loved comedians who is selling out arenas up and down the country with his hilarious Pablo tour. As Paul shares his journey, we explore his Irish heritage, which was discovered through an Ancestry DNA test.
We also uncover Paul's Liverpool ancestors, with stories of resilience, hard work and a will to succeed. We also reveal the heart-wrenching loss of young Bernard Cain and the harrowing experiences of Philip Cain during WWI. We also unearth the intriguing narrative of John Stenson, who made headlines in the 1880s for aiding the police during an assault.
Shifting our focus, we dive into Paul's maternal heritage, unveiling tales of heroism and tragedy that have shaped his ancestry. Discover the lineage of his great-grandfather Thomas Highton and the sombre story of Mary Ann Highton, who perished during the 1940 Blitz in Liverpool. This episode is a blend of humour, history, and heartfelt moments that you won't want to miss. Be sure to catch our engaging conversation with Paul Smith, and stay tuned for more incredible family stories in future episodes.
Links
To contact Michala
Paul Smith 'Pablo' Tour Tickets
Power of One
For Family History Research
Ancestry DNA Tests (Amazon affiliate link)
he stated that he was cleaning his rifle and it accidentally just went off I'd do that.
Speaker 2:A bit of a grass in my eyes, to be honest.
Speaker 1:He's brought shame upon me if I'm in tree so they took two distress calls from the titanic when it was thinking, oh, my god laurence nightingale. Shall we keep going back?
Speaker 2:Don't tell me you have to sit and read the newspaper. You would not believe.
Speaker 1:Hello and welcome back to Unearth the Past. It's me, dr Michaela Hume. As always this week, I am so excited I'm joined by one of my favourite comedians.
Speaker 2:One of.
Speaker 1:You know what he's going to catch me out this whole podcast. My top two favourite.
Speaker 2:I'll take that. I'll take that, that's good.
Speaker 1:My lovely guest Paul Smith.
Speaker 2:Hi Hi.
Speaker 1:You are selling out arenas left, right and centre. You are doing fantastically well. You have millions of followers on social media. You even have your own comedy club Amazing.
Speaker 2:Going all right.
Speaker 1:It's going all right, isn't it? Doing okay, doing all right, so before we delve into your tree, then, which I'm really excited about sharing with you. I've thoroughly enjoyed researching. Where did the comedy? Has it always been comedy for you?
Speaker 2:No, people get really disappointed. I'm quite quiet in real life. I'm quite shy. It's just something I did in my early 20s. It's kind of like my version of a bungee jump. I just wanted to do it once and then I just found that I was a lot more confident on stage. I've got something weird in me. Most comedians have this. We're not the most outgoing people, we just tend to be weirdly comfortable making a fool of ourselves, so that's just yeah.
Speaker 1:Once I did it, once I was like I need to keep doing that. I honestly think out of all the arts, it's the hardest thing to do to put yourself out there on stage and to make people laugh you know, yeah, it's hard.
Speaker 2:I find it quite natural to be honest. So, yeah, I'd rather do that than be a gymnast or something.
Speaker 1:Right, should we delve into your tree?
Speaker 2:Yes, please. I'm excited about this. I hope it's a good one and not, like everyone's, just a builder.
Speaker 1:What would be the worst case scenario, like a tree full of builders.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know. Everyone's called Smith and everyone's a builder. Well, obviously, there we go, cut. When I looked into your tree. Yes, everyone's called Smith and everyone's a builder. Well, obviously, oh, there we go, cut.
Speaker 1:When I looked into your tree straight away I thought, just because of your surname, I thought it's probably going to be difficult. Just because of how many Smiths they are, You've probably got a tree with some of the worst searchable surnames, like Smith Jones is another one. I could go on, but I thoroughly enjoyed researching it and I think we've done, I think I've done all right.
Speaker 2:How far back did you get to even give me a say?
Speaker 1:God. So on some of the lines back into the 18th century pretty comfortably.
Speaker 2:Oh nice.
Speaker 1:Weirdly, the most difficult line to research was obviously the Smith line.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And that's just because when I struggle with something, I always then go to your DNA. You have got Smith in your DNA and you've got the offshoots of the Smith branch in your DNA but weirdly, not many direct Smith cousin matches. You are definitely a Smith, you are. We know that because, for example, who the Smiths marry into you share all their DNA, but for some reason your branch of the Smith example who the Smiths marry into you share all their DNA, but for some reason your branch of the Smiths. Not many Smiths have taken a DNA test yet.
Speaker 2:OK.
Speaker 1:So I know. So if you're out there and you're called Smith and you are from Liverpool, please take a DNA test.
Speaker 2:And then message me if you're related to me.
Speaker 1:Well, having said that, I have had a message, believe it or not, from a distant cousin of yours, which we shall pick up on in a minute. Yeah. So when you took your Ancestry DNA test, it primarily tells me three things. The first one is it gives you an ethnicity estimate.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So it'll tell me you're 5% Irish, 10% Scottish, 97% Irish, 10% Scottish and we're going to 97% Irish.
Speaker 2:All his branches, laurie, go back to Ireland, like every branch goes back to Ireland. I'll take that.
Speaker 1:Then what else it does? It gives me your traits, so it tells me whether you're a morning person or a night person. I know we spoke about this in the lift.
Speaker 2:Laurie told me he gets angry, so it tells me that I'm losing a dog. Yeah, sorry, I'm being unprofessional. I brought my dog just in case anyone's wondering. Never work with animals, cyril, but we love Cyril On this podcast we actually prefer dogs to people. Yeah, we're going to do Cyril's next.
Speaker 1:Can I just say, joking aside, you can get a DNA test now for your dogs Ancestry. Do a dog DNA test.
Speaker 2:So, if you would like to know, I don't think he is a real cockapoo. He's too small.
Speaker 1:Oh, don't Look at that little face, sorry, I'm trying to be professional. So, primarily, your DNA then tells me three things it tells me your ethnicity estimate, it tells me your traits and it also provides me with cousin matches.
Speaker 2:So that's everybody that you share dna with oh, so that pops up on there and they can see that all pops up on there.
Speaker 1:So let's start, then, with the smith side of your family tree. Now, am I right by thinking that you'd looked into it a bit or you tried, I tried a while back.
Speaker 2:I didn't have much luck. I don't know how far back I got. I took the information that I had. But again, it's just there's such like common names that you like the way it was working. It was coming up and I was like I kind of assume that's the right person, but I mean it's like James Smith or something. So there's like 15 options. There's like 15 options. You're like I don't know if I pick the right guy now, so I could be completely going down the wrong path.
Speaker 1:So when you were going through your family tree because I've seen your family tree and I think it's actually pretty good and it did form the basis of where I sort of hopefully, developed it from yeah, okay. So I did manage to go back five generations on each side of your tree Awesome. So I've put a copy of the tree in front of you. You can have a look.
Speaker 2:Feel free pick it up, go for it. Yeah, so I remember seeing some of these because they're still flanneries. That's right so that must probably be right. And canes I knew there was canes on my dad's side because I remember they used to talk about them. Catherine Stenson, I hadn't seen that one, you've not seen that one no, I don't think so. It doesn't ring a bell, or bernard h kane? I must have done that completely wrong. I'm mary faddle. I must have done them wrong, yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah, so I'd gone completely the wrong way, hadn't I?
Speaker 1:well, it was a good start. I'll say that. So how? How we kind of, how we unpick that is? Uh, obviously I look at several different records marriage records, census records, birth records, um, and I did have to order a few certificates in just to make sure because of how popular the smith line is that we were on the right tracks. Then, when your dna results came back, it was great because you have cousin matches who are related to the canes okay, to the stent Okay.
Speaker 1:To the Stenson's. So that worked quite well, because then it meant that we were definitely on the right tracks with your cousin matches. Okay, I didn't find any comedians. I looked.
Speaker 2:Well, it's weird because I don't know if it's the same cousin. A guy messaged me earlier this year, like in early January, saying he was my distant cousin on my dad's side from. He lived in Australia and now he lives in America and he said that on his side there must be a second or third cousin. There was a comedian called Freddie Phillips.
Speaker 1:Okay, halt the podcast. So after we finished recording, I decided that I wanted to look into the claim that comedian Freddie Phillips was a distant relation. Now, even though I'd not found any comedians on a sort of immediate family tree so I'm talking parents, grandparents, great-grandparents, great-great-grandparents, et cetera, et cetera it didn't mean to say that Freddie Phillips was not a cousin, some sort of distant cousin on one of his branches. So I did a bit of digging. I got some old newspapers, had a look on the internet to see if I could find anything about this elusive comedian Freddie Phillips, and indeed I did so. I managed, from searching in the newspapers, to find out where he went to school and the area that he lived in. Now, if you're from the northwest, the area is known as the Wirral, we often call it over the water. Having this information, I then went back to the family tree and had a look at all the great aunties and uncles, great great aunties and uncles, and had a look at their children, and indeed I did find that one of Bernard Kane's daughters married a Phillips and they had a son called Frederick Phillips in 1949. Now I have ordered the birth certificate. It's not come back yet at the time of recording this podcast, but I do think it is a match.
Speaker 1:I had a look into Freddie and I had a look into his life and his career. He was born in 1949 in Liverpool. He was a singer and also a comedian. He was the lead singer in a group called Beano and they toured all the sort of northern working men's clubs in the 70s and the 80s. Beano was made up of Freddie, ken Smith, ray Johnson and another guy called John Birch. In 1986, he appeared as a stand-up comedian on a show called New Faces. You may have heard of New Faces. It's a show that people like Lenny Henry appeared on back in the day. The last snippet of information I could find about Freddie was that he'd moved to Tenerife with his partner, mary, and he was a local tour guide and apparently his tours were extremely funny. So yeah, so I've managed to track him up to about 2012. I don't know what happens to him after that date. So Paul Smith is related to a comedian called Freddie Phillips. Back to the podcast. So let's start by going down the Smith side then. So your granddad is Robert Smith.
Speaker 1:He was born in 1924 in Liverpool and the first record that I have for him is his marriage certificate. Now going back, so as you follow the family tree back, I managed to find Robert's parents, which were also Robert Smith and Jane.
Speaker 2:Harrell this is a joke, because my mum always laughs about this because his brother's called Bernard Robert and he's called Robert Bernard and I think that goes back and he tried to. So I'm Paul Robert. He tried to call me Robert Bernard. Did he and my mum would never.
Speaker 1:Not having it, she's like no, he's like.
Speaker 2:no, that's the stupidest thing ever. Yeah, so my mum saved me from that fate.
Speaker 1:Weirdly, they're all called robert, aren't they? So if you go back, it's all called robert. Managed to find robert smith and jane farrell, who were your great-grandparents just before world war ii, and they're living on lace street in liverpool in liverpool. Your great granddad was born in 1889. He was also born in liverpool and his father, which is your great great granddad, as I mentioned he's also called Robert and he's working as a carter.
Speaker 1:So basically he's like a probably a bit like a DPD driver of the day, so he's moving stuff back, back and forward. In 1901, the family are actually all living with their in-laws. They, they're living with the Cranes. I don't know if you can see that on the thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, jane Crane, that's it. That's a great name.
Speaker 1:Yeah, jane Crane, they're living with the Cranes and they're living in a court just off Gladstone Street. I actually have your great-great-grandparents' marriage certificate, if you would like to see it. Yeah, and just to make matters even more complicated, it's in latin because it's catholic, but I'm hoping, um, that you should just imagine you speak latin, so it's out I do what is that still street?
Speaker 2:yeah I want to try and find all these places so that I imagine a lot of them don't exist anymore.
Speaker 1:No, so the buildings have gone, but the streets are still there, so I have managed to get pictures, where I can, of some of them, but the buildings have gone, but the street is still there. So not only is this record in victorian, terrible handwriting it's also in latin. It's like the worst test I could have possibly given so it's robert s yeah something smith.
Speaker 2:What's her name?
Speaker 1:let me have a look here. We go right, so we've got. So they married, I think in june 1920, robert smith, right. So this is something that comes up a lot in your family tree is how you spell Smith. So sometimes it's been smelt, sometimes it's been spelt, is like Smythe, but it's still.
Speaker 2:Smith, it's just how the way they spell it.
Speaker 1:So they do S-M-Y-T-H.
Speaker 1:Oh okay, yep, so it's just another way to spell it. So, yeah, so they live on. I think it's Stilt Street. I think it's called Stilt Street. That's basically saying who are his parents? So his parents are Robert and Jane Smith, and again in brackets it's like Smythe. And then you've got Mary Farrell and her dad is patrick and ellen farrell, okay, and then they've got two witnesses who also, uh, they're the clarks and that is where robert smith is living. He's actually living with them at the time of this, this record, and the farrells are living at 35, so they're just two doors up, so they potentially could have met because they lived two doors up from each other which is quite nice.
Speaker 2:I suppose that's how people met before Tinder, isn't it?
Speaker 1:I don't think they were swiping, just waving. I did trace the Smiths as far back as the 1830s, right, and the problem I had was, when we get that far back, I'm solely relying on parish records and, because of how popular the name was, going back further than that was difficult because, to be honest, I just couldn't 100% say it was them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I was just guessing, and not enough. Basicallyith had taken a dna test for me to then sort of track it and go oh well, you shared distant dna with them, so it must be that branch. So it was hard. It was hard for me to go, to go back further than that with that side of your tree. I will say though and you're probably going to think I'm dead boring now they were all carters and porters and they were working on the docks, so, if it's all right with you, I'm gonna move on, because there's a lot that I want to talk about on the cane side yeah conscious of time yeah, I thought that'd be an interesting one because it was a my dad used to speak about that.
Speaker 2:I didn't know any of them, but that was like a name that always came up, so I imagine they were the interesting ones where nobody mentioned the smiths, um, so I'm gonna now then go on sticking with your dad's side yeah yeah, we're gonna talk about the canes.
Speaker 1:Do you remember any of the the cane side of your?
Speaker 2:no family. No, no, because I I mean I never met my granddad. On that side it says living here. Well, I hope he's not well, I hope it will be happy if it was. But I I was. I was told he was dead. So I mean I knew my nan, so I knew mary yeah obviously, but yeah, no, I didn't know anyone further back than that okay, well, let's, let's dive into that side then.
Speaker 1:So I'm going to start with your great-grandfather, who is Bernard Kane. So Bernard Kane was born in 1900. And his wife, your great-grandmother, was called Catherine Stenson, and just before the war the family are living at 28B Great Richmond Street. Now Great Richmond Street is obviously Liverpool. It pops up a lot on the sort of different sides of your family tree. All your family trees seem to be sort of around that area, like Burlington Street, scotty Road, you know all sort of that area.
Speaker 1:I don't know Liverpool that well. You two probably know it better than me, but they all seem to be around that neck of the woods. So just before the war then he is working in the warehouse of a sugar factory, and I think it's probably Henry, Tate and Sons which became I think Tate and Lyle. And that was on Love Lane. Yeah, the reason I think that is because his mum, who you can see on there, his mum's called Ellen, I don't know if you can see on there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Ellen Esther Glennon.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Ellen Glennon. She is working at the same factory on the 1921 census so I'm presuming she probably gets Bernard a job working in the factory that she works at. Missing from the register when I have a look at it are their two sons, and that is because the second son, which is Philip, was not born until 1943. However, the oldest son, Bernard, should be on the register. So I've mentioned that they've had all these kids. I've mentioned that they've got Mary Bernard, Josephine, Kathleen, Bernadette and Philip On the 1939 register. They're all on there except the two sons, right? And I found a record would explain why Bernard isn't on there. Philip isn't born yet, but I'm going to show you this record if that's alright, Okay.
Speaker 2:Oh God, fatally injured by bus. Oh no God, poor Bernard Boy who ran into the road. Bernard Kane, age six, son of a labourer living in Great Richmond Street, was knocked down by a rebel bus in St Anne Street on Wednesday and fatally injured. Aww. At the inquest held yesterday by the city coroner, the jury returned the verdict of death by misadventure. William Herbert Davis, cleansing Inspector, queen's Drive, liverpool, said he saw the boy run across the front of the stationary motor car into the path of a bus. The bus driver braked and swayed, but unsuccessfully. John taylor of langstreet road, kirkdale. The bus driver said his speed was about 12 to 15 miles an hour. The stationary motor car obscured his view and when the witness of first saw the child he was only four or five feet in front of the bus. Oh no, barb bernard, that's sad isn't it?
Speaker 1:yeah, as I say, I thought when I, when I looked at the record, I thought that he should be on the record and I thought why is he not on the record? And then, as I say, I had a look and then and then found that and the reason we know it's the right person is because of great richmond street.
Speaker 2:So it's that how do you find that? Don't tell me you have to sit and read news.
Speaker 1:You would not believe god that's so stressful yeah, I could pretend I'm a magician. No, I did that.
Speaker 2:I'd be fatally injured by a bus as well honestly, you become so patient yeah right, okay, so let's go back a step further then.
Speaker 1:So your great-grand, they got married in 1923. And I have a picture of them in later life, if you would like to see it. So that is Bernard.
Speaker 2:Oh, what a handsome chap.
Speaker 1:Yes, could you describe him? He looks quite dapper.
Speaker 2:He does look quite dapper. He looks well-dressed. I like his bowler hat. Has he got in his hand a little pocket watch or something, maybe a coin? Yeah, fiddler, I'm a fiddler. Yeah, I was always fiddling with something.
Speaker 1:Oh, were you a fiddler. Yeah, yeah, yeah, always got, yeah, yours, doesn't he? He looks he looks very dapper. Yeah, okay, so that is katherine stenson oh, she's fancy, wasn't she?
Speaker 2:it's a nice fair coat, isn't it? Yeah, she's pretty, isn't she?
Speaker 1:so that's my great nan yes, that's katherine stenson, your great grandmother. Oh so she seems to be you, you know, do you look like.
Speaker 2:I mean, unless that was the only time they ever got dressed up for those pictures? They?
Speaker 1:were like scruffs for the whole week. Yeah.
Speaker 2:She looks a bit like my mum, to be honest. Well, it was just weird because I was on a different side, totally different side. She looked like my mum when she was young. That's weird.
Speaker 1:So should we keep going back? Oh, and here is, by the way, this is the middle name. That's horrendous that I can't pronounce the middle name so I don't know if you can just see at the top what is that?
Speaker 2:you see, Hegesippes, hegesippes, that's not a name, that's got that's got to be some weird Irish like that's not a name that's got, that's got to be some weird irish like ancestry name to be fair his uncle has the same middle name.
Speaker 1:You know it first time to be a family thing first time I've ever come across it, so you've just seen a picture, then, of your great-grandparents. The next record we have is the 1921 census, and this has obviously got b on. And his mum, who I've mentioned, worked at the factory, the sugar factory and her name is Ellen Esther Glennon, so you can see her on the tree. I have the 1921 census if you would like to see it. So this is the 1921 census. Handwriting is appalling. Hopefully you'll be able to make out Bernard.
Speaker 2:So that's Ellen Joseph Bernard, and is it Florence?
Speaker 1:Florence.
Speaker 2:Nightingale, yeah, the actual Florence Nightingale, no but they obviously no.
Speaker 1:But your face then will be great and was like and then, I think, is joseph in there as well yeah, there's a joseph yeah joseph, is that what I mean?
Speaker 2:his brother, yeah, great, great uncle that would be correct, yeah yeah, so he's older, employment, love and so that's once employed on the railway.
Speaker 1:I think is it the London Railway, is it? Or it might be the Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway.
Speaker 2:Railway Port yeah yeah. Bernard, it says. I don't know what it says. Seaman, I don't think does it say Abel Seaman? Abel Seaman ah that's why I like boats so much. Yeah, I like fish, not like fish. No, that's a seaman, don't like fish. If you see a fish, you're dead. You fell off the boat, that's cool.
Speaker 1:Should we keep going back?
Speaker 2:yeah, what's what does it say for florence there? Let me have a look. Sorry, I'm trying to read, it's all right mate.
Speaker 1:Um. So so Florence Nightingale niece. She's 21 years old and five months. She's a female, she's single and she's just basically working at home. She's just sort of doing home duties so helping around, helping around the house. I don't know if you could make it out, but, as you can see, Bernard is an able seaman and at the time he's working for Cunard's.
Speaker 2:I managed to find some of his records, and he's actually working for Cunard's.
Speaker 1:I managed to find some of his records and he's actually working on Cunard's ship, which is called the Coronia, and this was it's got quite an in-depth history the ship because when the Titanic sunk, that ship was the ship that intercepted the message for ice and told the Titanic relayed to the Titanicanic that there was ice oh god yeah, and also, so it basically it told them that they were basically yeah could potentially hit an iceberg, and then, when it sunk and it was going down, they were the ones that took the distress call.
Speaker 1:So they took two distress calls from the titanic when it was sinking oh my god so and he, obviously he, he worked on on that ship I'm gonna say he's the one who took the call.
Speaker 2:I would actually say he took that call.
Speaker 1:He took that call. Now I know from his, from his war records, that he served on that ship during World War I. He was in the Merchant Navy. But that ship they converted it into an armed force merchant navy ship yeah I have an image of his merchant navy record if you would like to see it, ah, what a guy so there's a picture of him. He looks quite young, doesn't he?
Speaker 2:on that picture he does look quite young, he looks happy, yeah he's got very sort of slicked hair. Doesn't give us height. No.
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 2:That's cool.
Speaker 1:Sorry to interrupt the podcast, but this will only take a minute. I want to talk to you about an amazing organisation called the Power of One, which supports women across the globe who are involved in animal rescue. One of those women is Louise Hastie from War Paws. War Paws was created to support and provide a voice for all those animals caught up in conflict. Based in the heart of Iraq, louise and Ariana Samuelson run a sanctuary providing refuge for 700 dogs and also donkeys providing refuge for 700 dogs and also donkeys. However, inadequate facilities, financial pressures and a decline in rehoming rates are putting these animals at risk.
Speaker 1:But this is where you can help. Wharples are desperately trying to raise £25,000. Are desperately trying to raise £25,000. This money will build 23 new kennels, 5 airlocks and 21 concrete pools, which will help improve the animals living conditions. All the details of how you can support War Paws and the Power of One will be in the description below. I know times are tough, but if you can donate anything, that would be great. Or even if you just tell people about the Power of One and the amazing work that they are doing, we would be really appreciative. Thank you so much for listening. Now back to the podcast. I think it's probably fair to say that Bernard didn't have the best starts in life, and that was because when I was doing my research, I found that from the age of six months old he was in the workhouse oh no yes, so his mum, who, who you've you've looked at ellen.
Speaker 1:She was obviously married to her husband and I don't know if you noticed, but when you looked at the 1921 census, he wasn't there.
Speaker 1:He's not there. So what happens is she is married. The dad is called Philip Philip Joseph Kane and he's a tailor and they're doing pretty well with the tailoring business. So they're advertising in the local kind of trade directories. He is what we call a journeyman tailor, so that means that he's spent seven years as an apprentice and he's basically one under a master tailor and he's doing well. But when Bernard is only six months old he becomes ill and the whole family go into the workhouse. But when Bernard is only six months old he becomes ill and the whole family go into the workhouse. Now, I think he's in it because it's also a hospital, right, and if you don't have a lot of money, where do you get healthcare? Where do you get looked after? It's the workhouse infirmary. So I think he's in it. Because of that. He dies when Bernard is only three of a brain tumour.
Speaker 2:Oh God.
Speaker 1:All the family, her and her sons, are all in the workhouse but they don't stay in the workhouse. So on the next record I have for them, which is the 1911 census, they are split up. So she's got the oldest son, um, who's called philip. She's got him and she is living at 155 burlington street and next door in 157 is her parents, and they've got the other two lads. Okay, so basically the other two lads have gone to live with her parents.
Speaker 1:Now, in 1914, as we've mentioned because you've just had a look at Bernard's merchant navy record Britain joins World War I. Now, because of his age, we know that Bernard must have joined towards the end, towards the end of the war. Joseph, the other brother, I think it's him, I think he tried to fudge his age because he would have been well too young but got caught and and got kicked out. But Philip signs up. The other brother, philip signs up on the 1st of September 1914 and he signs up to the 12th battalion of the King's Liverpool regiment. I don't think he took particularly well to military life. So the next record that I found for him was on the 31st of August 1916 when he shot himself in the foot.
Speaker 2:Oh, thank God. Thank God, it was the foot. So what he just shot himself to get out of it.
Speaker 1:No, he just shot himself to get out of it. Now he stated I'd do that. This was not supposed to be the funny bit, so he stated that he was cleaning his rifle and it accidentally just went off. However, there were no witnesses and it was deemed that he actually did it willfully, on purpose.
Speaker 2:Oh no.
Speaker 1:And he was tried by court-martial.
Speaker 2:Oh God.
Speaker 1:Now I couldn't find the results, obviously because I don't know if those things are in the public domain, but he remained with the battalion, so the wound obviously wasn't that bad and he remains. He remained with the battalion, so I'm presuming that the punishment they didn't obviously kick him out, yeah yeah, so it was basically you stay.
Speaker 1:And which he did. Now, in the September of 1917, philip and his battalion are fighting in France and I know that because he actually appears in a record from the battalion and this is a record that his commander, when his commander's making notes, he mentions him in the notes, which is quite unusual. His commander at the time states that on the 19th and the 20th of September the battalion is subject to heavy fire in France and on the 26th of September there is more heavy shelling and heavy bombardment and the commander reports that Private Kane appears much shaken, which is unusual to report that. So he obviously was struggling with it.
Speaker 1:But you know, you have no choice, You've got to stay on here. Now, on the 20th of November, the battalion would take part in the Battle of Cambrai, which was a British offensive that happened in France, and this was, I suppose, a new way of looking at warfare, right, so they were not just using men going forward soldiers on the front line pushing forward with their guns.
Speaker 1:Now they were also using aeroplanes and for the first time tanks and his battalion are involved in this push, this Battle of Cambrai. Now, from the war diaries I know again because I've read them I know that the tanks managed to push through the German lines and they captured over 7,000 German soldiers. So initially it was a success. However, on the 30th of November the German army started a counter-attack and it's one of the biggest counter-attacks I think the German army actually did at that time and nobody was expecting it. But the Germans were basically waiting. They knew what was going to happen and they were waiting to counter-attack. So, even though his battalion had made some gains, inevitably they were now going to face the Germans who would push them back. The war diary states that just after 7.30am the enemy attacked in masses under a cover of heavy artillery barrage and heavy machine gun fire from a large number of low-flying aeroplanes.
Speaker 1:This is the first time that I've read aeroplanes being used in a war area. I'm not saying they weren't, it's just the first time that I'd come across it. The aeroplanes were not only firing on them, but they were also dropping bombs. The enemy had penetrated the line on the right, meaning that the battalion had to retire in order to avoid being cut off Due to the gunfire from the aeroplanes.
Speaker 1:the SOS signal was not met so they didn't hear the SOS signal because of all the gunfire from the German planes. Nine officers were reported missing, two officers were wounded, 55 regular soldiers were wounded, with 229 soldiers killed or missing. Philip was one of those missing. He was later declared as killed in action. His body was never recovered, but his name does appear on the Cambrai Memorial. Oh does it, do you want?
Speaker 2:to see his name on the memorial. Oh yeah, Where's that?
Speaker 1:So that's in Cambrai.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah, I need to go and see that.
Speaker 1:You were like oh, I thought it was going to be all happy. I know Everyone's dead oh god killed by a plane or if by a bus, I mean I'm saying that like I didn't know everyone was dead so you may be wondering then, what happens to the rest of the cane yeah the cane family.
Speaker 1:Um, it must have been particularly tough for Ellen because she's lost her husband really young he's obviously, you know, died of a brain tumour and then she loses her eldest son in World War. I Well, ellen remained living next door to her parents on Burlington Street right up until her death in 1932. Her parents were John Glennon and Mary Mulholland and they were from Louth in Ireland. I hope I've pronounced that right. They had 16 children, bloody hell.
Speaker 1:But sadly, only eight would make it to adulthood. John spent his whole life working on the railways and going back to your great-grandmother, great-great-grandmother. Sorry, ellen, who we've, who we've just spoke about. I have a copy of her. Uh, grave, if you'd like to see it.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, where's that?
Speaker 1:oh, your whole family, by the way, is buried in. Is it the ford cemetery, the catholic cemetery in um in liverpool how is? It. All of them, yeah, all of them. They're all in there, so I'm just I'm going tomorrow literally we love a graveyard.
Speaker 2:Don't we do, you oh?
Speaker 1:god, I thought that was just me, okay, okay.
Speaker 2:So the mother of sorrows intercede for the soul of Ellen Esther Cain, who died April 23rd 1932, aged 60 years, rip Erected by her son, joseph Cain. Also Bernard Cain, grandchild of a both, who died January 7th 1937, aged seven years.
Speaker 1:So he was the little one that ran out in front of the car he's also in that plot as well Now, as we've already mentioned, ellen had, you know, a pretty tough beginning, losing husband, the whole family's in the workhouse. You know they're really struggling, but I did manage to find her probate, so what, what? She left when she died. I thought I'd just let you have a look at that, ellen esther of 157 burlington street, liverpool.
Speaker 2:Widow died 26th april 1932 at 28 catherine terrace, broad green road, old swan, liverpool, probate liverpool. 13th september to edwards marshall. 6th April 1932 at 28 Catherine Terrace, broadgreen Road, old Swan, liverpool, probate, liverpool. 13th September to Edwards Marshall Steelworker and James Alfred Martin, solicitors, managing Clerk effects £1,435, 17 shillings, 11. What's?
Speaker 1:I've put that in brackets. What it is today £125,000 flying.
Speaker 2:She's alright then, isn't she?
Speaker 1:She ended up all right, didn't?
Speaker 2:she, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:After being in the workhouse struggling.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:She did okay, so going back down the Cain road. So I don't know if you can see on there, but I went back to your third time great-grandfather, philip Cain. Yeah, he was born in 1841. And he actually came. He's the one that came over from Ireland settled in Glasgow oh really didn't come straight here and I think in Glasgow is where he served his apprenticeship. He settled in Glasgow and while he's in Glasgow he meets your great, great great grandmother, sarah Gillan.
Speaker 2:She should be on there as well and while he's in Glasgow he meets your great, great great grandmother, sarah Gillan she should be on there as well. No, this one's no better for it I think, oh no, it doesn't Sorry.
Speaker 1:Sorry. Yeah, right, when you actually go on it, if you press the little arrows it'll take you back. Sarah Gillan she was Irish, but at the time her family were living in Scotland. They meet, they fall in love and they both decide to move to Liverpool. Philip, as was his son, was a journeyman tailor and the family live on Richmond Row and they live at number one Richmond Row and he again he's appearing in trade directs for us all the time, sort of promoting himself and his business.
Speaker 2:I looked at richmond row and I think it's likely that it was a shop yeah it looks like shops, I'm presuming that it was above the shop potentially a taylor's shop and that they're living above the shop.
Speaker 1:I'm gonna move now because I'm conscious of time. I thought it goes really fast onto your mum's side of the tree, okay, so shall we have a? Shall we go down? Is it thomas hyten?
Speaker 1:your great grandfather yeah, so thomas hyten, your great grandfather on your mum's side. He was born in 1902 and he was one of seven children born to james hyten and ellen kelly in 1911, james and Ellen are living on Bisbon Street and James is a blacksmith and he continues to be a blacksmith throughout the whole way through. I don't think it's horses, I think it's more like metalwork than horses, but that's what he's doing, cool. Now, the oldest of the Hyten children is Mary Ann, ann and mary ann. She was born in 1899 and in 1924 she married a guy called thomas rimmer and just before the war in 1939, she is living with her husband and children on blackstock street that's where the comedy club's there.
Speaker 2:No, that's where we just opened the comedy club.
Speaker 1:That's mad no way it's called blackstock martha oh my god, so yeah, so I saw that. So obviously when I was doing a bit of research, right. So when I was looking and I'd seen you doing this new comedy club, you won't believe I got a phd. Didn't actually put the two together, that that is the place so that's my great grandmother.
Speaker 2:So that so. So, auntie yeah, so.
Speaker 1:So this would be. Uh, your great grandfather was born in 1902. This is his sister. Yeah, yeah, they live on blackstock street. You two know that very well now, on the night of the 20th of December 1940, the Blitz German bombs start dropping all over Liverpool. And what Mary does? She grabs her belongings and her family and she goes into the Blackstock Gardens shelter to take cover because the bombs are dropping. And I have another record for you now. So this is a list of all the civilian deaths that happened during the war oh god, so she, so she died there so they dropped a bomb on the shelter and
Speaker 2:they killed over 200 people oh my god, the 1940 black stock gardens.
Speaker 1:That's mad, that's so weird now there is a memorial to. So at the time there was a blackout on the reporting right so you couldn't report it, so I couldn't find any newspaper articles about her death. Um, and that's because at the time the newspapers obviously they weren't reporting anything that was happening from the Germans to us because we were all fine. And it was only later on that I came across what had happened in a later edition of the Echo and there's now. There was never a memorial and there's now a memorial to the victims. Over 200 people died that day when the bomb came through the shelter. And there's now. There was never a memorial and there's now a memorial to the victims. Over 200 people died that day when the bomb came through the shelter.
Speaker 1:And think about it, that's the place you go, because yeah, yeah and no they, they bombed the, the area shelter, yeah that's so mad there's so much to your family tree, paul. We could honestly go on for 50 hours, but I'm going to send you the link, yeah, so you can have a look at that. If that's all right, have a look at it. If you've got any questions or there's any parts you want to ask me about it, just drop me a whatsapp, yeah, and I'll reply basically.
Speaker 2:I want to do your editing with this for the next like month or so there was an interesting article actually that I'm going to show you on the stenson side.
Speaker 1:John stenson, who I think is, should be on your tree, might you might just be off it yeah, he actually appears in the newspaper in 1880.
Speaker 2:For good things, though actually for good things I will not that well, he's dead, he's definitely dead um so for basically sticking up for the police oh god, that's not.
Speaker 2:That's not good for me either. Oh god, this is probably the worst thing that's happened. We have to cut this off. Your name is mud, no good reputation. You're doing stoning, stoning and kicking the police and shields.
Speaker 2:And martin wel Walsh were brought up before Mr Raffles on Monday, charged with assaulting police constable 973 and John Stenson in Addison Street. The officer stated that Mr AB4 and Mr Savage were taking the depositions of a man need him. The prisoner came rushing up to the door and wanted to be admitted into the house. The constable refused to admit them and they kicked him about the legs. Stenson assisted the constable to take the prisoners into custody. Henny was also assaulted.
Speaker 2:It was stated there were about 600 people assembled at Addison Street and Scotland Road. A fine of 20 shillings and cost was imposed in default 14 days. Bridget Sammon, james Flanagan and Anne Kilcoyne were charged with throwing stones at Police Constable 973 and John Stenson in Scotland Place on Monday. As Stenson and the officer were moving to the Bradwell Shears in Walsh, the above three prisoners threw a number of stones and brick bats at them. They were both struck by the missiles, but not seriously injured. Other constables arrived on the spot and took the prisoner into custody, mr Raffles fined each of them 20 shilling and costs, in default, 14 days imprisonment, god. So someone was getting fair play, someone was getting stoned and he just.
Speaker 1:He intervened, intervened. He obviously fancied himself a bit, though you know.
Speaker 2:Bit of a grass in my eyes. To be honest, he's brought shame upon my family tree.
Speaker 1:Cyril's funeral the dogs they're sowing me in heaven we've obviously not got time to do this properly, but just quickly, I will just give you your traits oh yeah it says you are most likely to have a pet. Don't believe it.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, Right. It says you are most likely to have a pet. Don't believe it.
Speaker 1:It says you are likely to get hangry.
Speaker 2:That is probably true, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it says you are unlikely to play an instrument. Now, I thought you'd have played a guitar.
Speaker 2:No, I don't.
Speaker 1:It says you're a night person, not a morning person. It says you are a risk taker yeah, I don't know about this one. It says you are not a nap taker.
Speaker 2:That is absolutely incorrect. I have a phenomenal laugh to. Is he? I'll?
Speaker 1:nap.
Speaker 2:right now it says you are, it's a bit 50-50, likely to have unattached earlobes. So yeah, I think you are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think so, and then it says your index finger is longer than your ring finger. Now I think your index finger's this one, and it is. Yeah, Paul. Thank you so much for coming on my podcast.
Speaker 2:I hope you've enjoyed that little sneak peek into your family tree. Thank you so much. I can't wait to go and have a proper dig into it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, go and have a look into it and, as I say, if you've got any questions, by all means just drop me a message.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much.
Speaker 1:And that's it. Thank you so much. Thank you. So that is it for this week's podcast. A huge thank you to my amazing guest, paul Smith. If you haven't done already, check out his website. He's on tour at the minute. I don't know if there are any tickets left, but I'll put a link in the description below.
Speaker 1:A huge thank you to Samantha Hutchinson for supporting this podcast and the Power of One. Thank you. I couldn't make these podcasts without you. Research assistants on this episode are Lucy Stott and Javeria Salim. Editing is by Progress Media. And last but by no means least, thank you to you, to every single one of you that takes the time out of your day to listen to this podcast. I really, really appreciate it. And don't forget, if you want to get in touch with me, if you want to send me a message, you can do so via my website, which is wwwmichaelahumecom, or you can get me on social media. I shall stick the links in the description below so I will catch you next week with another amazing guest and another very interesting family tree. You will not want to miss it. See you next week.